The IC Authority Problem

As many of you may know, ICly, people have massive problems with authority, and it has culminated to the point where we are bound, unable to do anything without serious public outcry, and it's started ruining RP for myself, as well as others who are responsible for enforcing the law. At this point, a few things have been suggested to address this problem, and they are as-follows:

Consequences for Disrespecting the Guard
While many people don't like to see their characters lose, and this is why they do this, consequences must be administered for degrading/disrespecting the guard publicly. While this takes away a modicum of freedom from RP, it will hopefully, smooth things out in the long run.

Making Prisons Inescapable
Every time somebody has found their way to break out, and disregard the "ask an officer to roll" rule. It has been recommended that we make it so that the prisons can't be escaped, and the player understands the weight that crimes carry, ICly and OOCly.

If anyone has any other ideas, feel free to post them up here.

I can attest to being burned out. It's why I don't really like to RP for very long, and why, like this week, when I do log in, I want to just do actual game stuff (trials, pledges, leveling, etc). I'm SO TIRED of having to break fights up.

There was legit one time when Lulie kept trying to say, "So, Lady Nightwind, wher-" *interrupted by fight then it gets settled* "Lady Nightwind, wh-" *interrupted by another fight, Elsy shouts some things, it gets settled* "Miss Nightwind, are you from arou-" *interrupted again* "I guess you're busy..."

I WAS UNABLE TO RP BECAUSE OF FIGHTS. I could not even carry a simple conversation. And I'm tired of it. I want to be able to be in the tavern to RP without having to intervene with things. I want to be able to not have to go off with Ali or on occasion the Inspector or Thorn or Menelin, just to get a moment to RP like I'd like to.

I'm for both of these changes listed above.

Basically, we just want people to understand that we are NOT in any way demanding that people change their rp style. We are ASKING for people who have abrasive characters like that to please tone it down for now. Please just listen and cooperate with guards more often. Remember that the guards are rpers too and they are getting pretty sick of rping a job that a lot of people neglect to give respect to. We know that no one means to be an a-hole OOCly to these people. Bar fights can be fun, but in small doses and spaced well apart from each other.

Oh fine, I'll stop bashing people in the bar... :p

I like it. I think this will help bring about some order and better rp with the guards as well as others who get involved.

As much as I love IC drama, holy moly am I tried of fights.
I retired Fedris as a guard after I had to settle FIVE arguments/fights in one night, didn't help that no one listened to him.

If people really want to brawl, maybe we can suggest they take it outside the village.

I think letting people fight it out is fine, as long as they're not in the middle of the tavern. Maybe instead of breaking up fights, we can just make them take it outside, and out of the way.

What we need to do is offer a -legal- alternative to the fighting, such as the aforementioned sparring. The reason I don't come around on Menelin anymore is because, since these fights are -illegal-, I'd have to do something about it, and if I tried, the entire tavern would erupt into outrage and try to fight the guards on the arrest. If we were to make this a public option, and possibly extend prison times for assault, we could dramatically cut back on having to actually break them up.

That's true.
Taking them out of rp by putting them in jail is a good deterrent for most though, or making them rp community service (though they would need to be babysat)

I think
1) yes to increased jail time and enforce it so that unless people wanna RP in a jail cell, they don't really get to RP with that char
2) let people spar legally, no weapons, by the fighters guild hall

Also another option, if everyone consents, fights can be taken out of town if they wanna get really violent and into things that would get them arrested. This happened last night and worked alright. Writes and Tsal got into it, Elsy said to take it outside, they both decided to fight outside of the town instead because they wanted to get REALLY violent. Elsy didn't have to know about it because it was out of town, I didn't have to leave RP.

My only struggle with this is, it's a tavern and fights happen. I think squashing tavern fights entirely really squashes some good RP. I think the real issue is that people are not respecting the consequences to their actions. I mean, if a guard isn't around, then maybe we should just let them kill each other. That may eliminate some problems as well :)

Rogin The Bulwark wrote

My only struggle with this is, it's a tavern and fights happen. I think squashing tavern fights entirely really squashes some good RP. I think the real issue is that people are not respecting the consequences to their actions. I mean, if a guard isn't around, then maybe we should just let them kill each other. That may eliminate some problems as well :)

I don't want to stop them entirely. The issue with letting them be is, Elsy wouldn't. Menelin wouldn't. Our characters are obligated or at least feel obligated to jump in an diffuse situations. It's not in Elsy's character to let it happen. And the other thing is at least for Mullet and I, we ARE the guard. "If a guard isn't around." Sure. But Elsy and Menelin are guards or at least authority figures. When they are around there are guards around. I cannot RP Elsy around without dropping that authority and nor can Menelin. In this suggestion, it basically screws Mullet and I and forces us to play alts if we don't want to have to deal with fights. Which isn't cool. I love Elsy and I love RPing her. I should be able to go around and RP with her the way I want to, to an extent. At least to the point where RP is fun. I don't want to have to create a whole new character to be able to just have a normal conversation.

I realize your suggestion may have just been in jest but even still, it's an issue I'm personally having. I don't like to RP much anymore because of the amount of fights I end up having to deal with. It's not fun. And I want it to be fun again.

I have admittedly considered even taking breaks because of how draining and not fun it is.

That's why I think letting them spar outside legally is a good alternative. It allows our lawful goods to be able to not have to constantly jump in and still allows for RP fights to break out.

Appreciate your response, I'm just trying to make sure I understand what we are suggesting.

1. More consequences for players that do not listen to the guards
2. Jail is inescapable
3. Move the fight to a friendly spar outside of town

1. I think that makes sense. Just like in the real world, the more you amp it up and disregard authority, the more consequences you earn
2. I'm not sure 'making the jail inescapable' is going to solve this issue. If someone doesn't want their character in jail, they will either 'escape' by roll or just make the decision to 'escape'. I think that if someone is not adhering to the IC guidelines, then it will need to be handled OOC. So I would think we could leave the 'escape by roll' in place, but deal with it OOC.
3. I think some characters may choose that option, but in the heat of an argument, some will not listen to reason, go outside, fight and then hug. I think fights would still happen in the tavern, but those characters would have to face the IC consequences of their actions.

The last thing any of us want to do is get burned out doing something that we enjoy. If hanging in the Tavern is draining, then you may want to RP outside of the tavern. I know I take breaks from the tavern because it never fails that I end up getting into conversations with multiple people and trying to answer whispers at the same time. Sometimes I enjoy it, other times I need a break.

I also think recruiting more guards would be helpful so that we have one or two on duty during our peak RP times.

My numbers are in response to your responses.

1. Yep
3. It's possible we don't make it inescapable, and continue to allow them to roll for escapes. We would, yes, just have to make sure we totally crack down OOCly on anyone who kind of just casually walks out of jail like, "Oh my sentence is up now I've decided."
3. That's true. I feel like it'll settle a lot of the petty type things that are just people wanting to get a rise out of others, which will (theoretically) significantly cut down on the amount of times we have to intervene. That way the bigger, more serious issues are left, and we can make proper arrests then. Which, hopefully, will be a lot less frequent than the petty stuff, and should free myself, Mullet, and others up. Because I know I, and I can guess Mullet, definitely do not mind doing the jobs our characters have, it's just getting to the point where it's overwhelming, and so the ability to say, "Hey take it outside," to the smaller things is going to be a lot nicer.

Yeah, it's why Elsy and Ali will go off on their own from time to time, but I like the idea of Elsy starting to sit up in the tree in the center of town. I could give her proper Bosmer gear and she can really look the Treethane part.

Yep, Mullet's already begun recruiting, but if you know anyone who'd like to join, feel free to send 'em our way.

OH and there were a few changes plus one more. What we are suggesting is as follows:

1. More consequences for players that do not listen to the guards, such as, longer jail times
2. Jail is inescapable (maybe, or at least crack down on the "you can't escape unless you roll with an officer present" rule)
3. Move the fight to a friendly, legal spar in town (by Fighters Guild hall or something)
4. If they want to get more violent than #3, or do something more illegal, have the parties involved decide to take it out of town, saying that they're leaving to go settle it on their own, as guards don't have to deal with it there (just make sure all players consent)

Thanks Elsy, all of that makes sense.